ULI To Hold Chouteau Lake Competition
The Urban Land Institute along with some local organizations, including St. Lousi University, are sponsoring a competition for part of the proposed Chouteau Lake/Greenway area. With a submission deadline of February 6th it doesn’t give much time. From the Competition Brief:
The development site is an approximately 100-acre parcel encompassing a block on both sides of Grand Boulevard, bounded by Spring Street at the west and Theresa Street at the east; and spanning the proposed Chouteau Greenway, from Forest Park Boulevard at the north to Chouteau Avenue at the south. The northern and southern boundaries abut the north and south campuses of SLU, and your master plan must suggest ways in which your development would connect to the existing campuses and other neighborhood amenities.
In prior posts I’ve commented on the new SLU research buliding currently under construction to the south of this site — basically that it is an anti-urban tower sitting in the center of a green field. I’ve also written that when the Grand Boulevard bridge is rebuilt it should have street-level retail added to each side to “bridge” the gap of the tracks below.
Click here for the ULI Competition website.
[UPDATED 1/30/06 @ 9AM – I found the 2004 project in Columbus Ohio where retail was placed along both sides of a bridge spanning a major urban interstate. It is called the ‘Cap at Union Station.’ Click here to see the developer’s website on the project (includes many photos and a site plan).
From the ULI:
The Cap at Union Station is a $7.8 million retail development that reconnects downtown Columbus, Ohio, with the burgeoning Short North arts and entertainment district. Opened in October 2004, the project effectively heals part of a 40-year scar that was created by the construction of the city’s Interstate 670 (I-670) inner-belt highway. Composed of three separate bridges—one for through-traffic across the highway, and one on either side for the retail structures—the Cap provides 25,496 square feet (2,369 square meters) of leasable space, transforming the void caused by I-670 into a seamless urban streetscape with nine retail shops and restaurants. While other cities like Seattle and Kansas City have erected convention centers over urban highways, the I-670 Cap is one of the first speculative retail projects built over a highway in the United States.
– Steve
SLU’s research building will be a great addition to midtown St. Louis and is a terrific step forward for SLU medical center. I think the finished building is going to be a strong addition to the skyline of midtown, providing an interesting visual complement to the Peveley “tower” just across the street as well as SLU Hospital. Most of the buildings that were torn down were in terrible shape, and had little or no interest from an architectural perspective. Moreover, this building will make more development surrounding the site possible, and this is a very good thing. Eventually, I suspect this will make possible some additional housing development in the area. (There’s a lot of vacant land on the east side of Grand that could be new housing developments similar to the nearby Pyramid and Vatterott developments.)Also, it’s good to see
SLU take an interest in the Grand Metro stop, which is an embarrassment to Metro — from the grafitti strewn area under the bridge, the urine-scented elevators and the terrible lighting. Change in this area is a good thing, and SLU should be praised for this. If this development ever happens, it’s going to be a wonderful thing.
[REPLY – While I agree that the many buildings that once existed on the research building’s site were nothing special I do not agree the new construction is an asset. In fact, it is a major urban liability. It make help the skyline but it is going to do nothing for the streetscape. We are a city. We should not be building towers in the middle of greenspace! SLU had the chance to do something urban with the site but instead wasted it and we will have to endure the dead sidewalk for decades. – SLP]
Looks like a student project competition. Application deadline was Mid December, so those participating had two months to develop a proposal.
Should be interesting to see what they come up with.
[REPLY – I just found out about it and didn’t have time to read all the materials. Hope they had a good response, I’ll be interested to see what they come up with. – SLP]
Hey guys,
I’m taking part in the competition and am still trying to get a feel for the area. What is the area like south of the site? I’ve found plenty of data on the midtown area but little about the gate distict, Tiffany etc. Any good suggestions on what would go well on the site? Your input is much appreciated.
Thanks
Zac
UT austin
[Tiffany is under rated in my view. A little too many street blockages for my taste but the building stock is in good shape. Gate District is hit or miss, with some awful new houses among some good new houses. Lots of bad new churches and other non-tax paying properties. The medical center and parking garages have decimated the street grid so connectedness is poor. – SLP]
Thanks for pointing this out, Steve. This project is a great way to generate ideas for connecting Metro’s stop at Grand to the surrounding areas.
If you have a chance, I’d like to hear more about your view that that the new Grand Boulevard bridge should have ‘street-level retail added to each side to “bridge” the gap of the tracks below.’ Do you actually mean ALONG the bridge, like they have in Florence over the Arno? Pretty nifty idea… but would it be viable??
[REPLY – I swore I did a post on a new retail bridge in somewhere like Ohio but I cannot find the post, it may have gotten deleted by accident. Anyway, yes a retail bridge is feasible. Basically you have shallow storefronts which are built adjacent to the bridge’s sidewalk. These can have retail or restaurants. The idea is to “bridge” the pedestrian gap from end to end so that as you are walking you don’t feel like you are in a dead zone. With all the pedestrians at the MetroLink stops this could be great. You allow on-street parking and treat it no different than any other street. – SLP]
Is it dangerous and difficult for retail and restaurants to be suspended over a valley with the bridge? How will trucks deliver produce and merchandise? How do people cross from one side to the other with busy thuroughfare traffic? Do you have a link to other website where this has been done?
[REPLY – It took me a while to find the recently completed project and it is pretty cool. It is Columbus’ ‘Cap at Union Station.’ I’m going to add a link as an update above. – SLP]
Isn’t Chouteau Lake, if it is ever built (it won’t be) supposed to be downtown, south of the ballpark disctrict?
[REPLY – I haven’t studied the plan but I think you are correct. However, the area under Grand Boulevard will be part of the greenway which connects the proposed lake to Forest Park. – SLP]
This was done a LONG time ago. Try searching “Pontevecchio” which was orignally built during the roman rule.
Jason
A few things:
1. A retail bridge sounds neat in theory, but I don’t think it’s feasible for a few reasons:
a. It’s too friggin big of an area.
b. It would be way too expensive. I think we are probably lucky to be getting the upgrade that we are.
c. There is no real retail density in the area to begin with. Let’s try to come up with a real retail plan to make midtown a little more like the loop, or the area around the hospital a little more like south grand. If there was some kind of run on locations to house a business, it would be one thing, but there isn’t.
2. I’m all for the revitalization of downtown. All for bringing st. louis back. However, I’m a little tired of all of the kvetching over the research building.
1. What is that area losing? The wharehouse of fixtures? It’s not like a hotbed of street level retail was torn down. You have Pevely. A Captain D’s. A Rally’s.
2. The LAST thing that section of grand needs is street level retail. I would just as soon tear out every parking meter from Lafayette to Lindell. It’s too congested as is. Not EVERY street and EVERY corner needs to have street level retail. REALLY.
3. Why don’t we take a step back and quit bitching about the lack of brick and glass storefronts and realize what we ARE getting. This building is going to help SLU be on the forefront of research in some key areas, namely, bio-defense, AIDS, Cancer and liver disease. Let’s root SLU on and hope that they make major strides in those areas.
It’s not even an area worth a gripe, but if you want to do something, encourage SLU to invest more dollars in employer assited housing. They have a successful program that has brought faculty and staff back to the midtown area to live as well as work. Why not create an incentive for graduating seniors, to help populate Midtown?
[REPLY – So you want a plan to make the hospital area more like the Loop or South Grand yet you want to remove parking meters and not to worry about the empty space around the research building. Huh? Sorry, I don’t get how that would work.
The Grand bridge is not too big for retail. The money to improve the bridge could be derived from selling the rights to a developer(s) to have retail. I’ll have a new post on this shortly.
I agree what was torn down for the research building was nothing special (it was peerless, not warehouse of fixtures, btw). The point is if we are clearing the land and starting 100% from scratch I’m suggesting we build in an urban fashion. That site could have had a the street grid continue, some street level retail, some afforable housing and a research tower (or two or three). The same amount of land could have done so much more for the immediate area and the city. It is a wasted opportunity.
I have no love for the Rally’s, Captain D’s or the gay bars to the east. That is why I’m advocating we look at urbanizing Grand, you know, like the Loop or further south on Grand. – SLP]
Sorry, i had WoF on the brain. That, and the Continental Building, are examples of the kinds of urban redevelopment SLU supports.
I want the the grand and lindell area to be more like the loop. If you want to create a retail area to serve the hospital, do it off grand. Really.
[REPLY – I’d like Grand & Lindell to be more like the loop too but three of the four corners are spoken for. When the bank was on the corner where the fountain is now the area was much more bustling. Once new buildings are built in the NE corner it will help. – SLP]
I’m all for urban improvement, but we can’t sacrifice real progress for the sake of having storefronts.
[REPLY – This is exactly the kind of BS I’m sick of. “Real progress”? Geez, why can’t we have new construction that is urban? Returning our city to a more urban and sustainable formula is real progress, anything else is status quo. – SLP]
Yes, there is a lot of greenspace, and a fountain, and just one research tower.
However, trees and fountains are easily torn down when the funding exists for a second tower to be erected. People made the same gripe when laclede town was torn down for a park and a gazebo, and an arena will rise on that spot.
[REPLY – So the tower is not even finished and already you are cutting down the trees and buiding out the site? Why not plan a multi-phase project that when completed is urban? – SLP]
As far as low cost housing…there is plenty of that in the area. What the area needs is higher end housing, and that location is hardly suited for that.
[REPLY – Actually, low cost housing is not plentiful but you are right that we need more high end housing as well. Both could be in this area, no need to segregate by class as in the burbs. – SLP]
Plenty of low-cost housing in Midtown?
Where?
I’m not advocating segregating anything. I’m just saying between the gate district and mccree town, there are plenty of open lots. Those areas need investment before new housing is built.
I don’t think every street, every corner, or every development needs to have store fronts and street level retail to be a viable, important part in St. Louis development.
The Research Building will be an absolute asset to St. Louis.
[REPLY – The research building deserves an A+ for its design but the site planning is a big F. Different site planning could have given us the research building and some urban context
Not every foot of sidewalk needs to have retail. But every foot does need to have buildings and activities to make walking a pleasure. Short blocks, storefronts, apartment entries, office entrances, sidewalk cafes and such add interest for the pedestrian. This we need in the city – everywhere! – SLP]
The results of the student ULI competition have been posted on the website. I am quite amazed at some of the ideas. Some are a little out of touch with what will work in St. Louis. Check them out, and let’s get this thread going again.
http://udcompetition.uli.org/
Click on ‘Finalists/Hon. Mentions’
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