As a city resident, I couldn’t vote for proposition M, but many thanks to the county folks who know the need for a surviving system of public transit with the hope of expansion. Long live well-funded and widely appreciated public transit, and let’s hope ‘M’ survives the night.
Missouri blew 6000 votes on independent candidates who didn’t stand a chance. Thank you Nader for keeping Missouri in the red (read with sarcasm of course). As for Proposition M, its too bad. I don’t have a good grasp on this one as I couldn’t vote for it, but my understanding is now Metro will have to cut services to areas west of 270 among other things. At least now they know who their core supporters are and we can get back on track to making Metrolink and Metro help those who care about it. It was not just about expanding metrolink. Are they now going to cut late night service for metrolink so those leaving the ball game will not be able to get back to the park and ride lots? Does this mean more cars coming downtown for the games? I heard some of the money was going to help expand the park and ride lots so people aren’t ticketed for parking along the service road because they can’t find space in the lot. I would be interested in seeing who supported this in the county and if they used these lots, or if those who used the lots turned down the proposition. Nevertheless- lets go south with Metrolink- maybe Jefferson County will want it instead.
Looks like Missouri has “won” the distinction of being the only “battleground” this year not going with the nation. But since this was the first time with a non-southerner leading the Dem ticket since the 1960s, I’d argue my native state never truly was really a bellwether, but more culturally, a North Arkansas. And with St. Louis and Kansas City defeating transit, when the most pro-transit White House taking office next year, even the “urban” voters of Missouri have decided not to move towards a different future.
This native St. Louisan now living in Charlotte for just over a year, I had joked with friends, if a state didn’t go blue this election, that’s somewhere I’d frankly think twice before moving there. Well, it looks like I’ve moved from somewhere held back by its majority to someplace where new voters can make a difference. Given the demographic track my former and new residences are on, this disparity will sadly only grow.
In summary, I always suspected I had moved to New South. Last night confirmed VA and NC really are the New South. But I never fully realized until last night I was already living in the Old South in St. Louis.
Considering the demographics of the state of Missouri and its most recent presidential election cycle voting history, I’d say the description of Bellwether has become inapt if not an outright anachronism. Bellwethers shift with prevailing waves of motion, and this simply hasn’t been that accurately applied to this state. One positive point of the state staying red in this historic election year is that we can all shut the hell up about “as goes ______________, so goes the nation”. A convincing mark of Change is the upheaval of seemingly intractable trends or traditions. Missouri got punked by a head fake, and the sign of the bellwether has likely been stolen by a New Mexico or a Nevada.
Jason: “It was not just about expanding metrolink.”
No, it definitely wasn’t. It wasn’t even just about Metrolink at all, but the [limited] public debate about the proposition focused only on potential expansion and service cuts to the light rail system. In the months and weeks leading up the election, I was surprised at how little attention was being paid to the potentially massive cuts to bus service throughout the area. Scores of people, living in both the county and the city, depend on MetroBus to get to work, not to mention taking their kids to school and doing necessary shopping. It frustrates me that beyond the attention given expanding MetroLink to Westport, virtually all the discussion on service cuts (which to me was a far more pressing component of the issue than expansion) focused merely on people from West County not being able to ride the train to baseball games. Do our local commentators simply not realize that not everyone can afford or chooses to buy a car?
This is not an issue of charity, either. Depriving unskilled workers a reasonable mode of transportation is a big blow to the local economy. I suspect outer county voters didn’t take into account when casting their ballots that it might suddenly become much more difficult to staff their fast food restaurants, cleaning crews, and security guard needs.
Also, to those who say “let those who use it pay for it,” I would say the same of basic road maintenance and the hugely expensive 64/40 overhaul. Let those who insist on driving in single-occupant vehicles all over the place pick up the tab for new road construction and maintenance by instituting tolls on all major roads. Holy mackerel, could you imagine the scale of the outcry if THAT issue were on the ballot?
Caveat: I am a voter in St. Louis County, not someone criticizing from the City or elsewhere. Needless to say, I am hugely disappointed (though not surprised) in the decision my electorate made last night against Prop M.
The defeat of proposition ‘M’ is punch to the gut. The suburbs are choking civilized communities, and apparently those living in sparsely populated areas and the suburbs will need to suffer a bit before they can fully appreciate the impact of some of their decisions. Sprawl pattern development drains a region’s ability to EFFICIENTLY provide the balance of services a healthy metropolitan area relies on. Limiting ourselves to one-dimensional mode of transit, and the most energy consumptive and land despoiling mode at that, is about as shrewd as paying for life’s typical expenses on a high interest rate credit card, letting the balance grow and grow past each billing cycle, and living from paycheck to paycheck just to survive-without any savings or investments for future need. Dumb.
Face it- when voting, the majority of the general public do little to educate themselves. They expect to be educated by the proponents or opponents of whatever we should have them vote on. Most of the time this is through ads on TV, flyers in the mail, robo-calls, billboards, signs, etc.. Even then they rarely pay attention until they get to the booth on election day. Then, quickly scanning the ballot they see the proposition short explanation… its going to cost the taxpayer “X” for “Y”. They evaluate …Will “Y” help me or my family?… No- okay, I check NO and move on. Yes? then I might check yes and move to the next one. This happened with every ballot initiative put before St. Louis city and from what I could tell, the majority of St. louis county and other outlying areas. Prop A- free so it passes. Prop B- also free and also passes. Prop C- pass. Prop M- costs STL county taxpayers so it fails, Classrooms for Kids in Festus? Hell no. Why should kids get the summer off anyway? The only people voting yes on that one actually had kids or were planning on having kids in the school district. As you can see- unless it affects the majority for the better there is no way any proposition asking the masses to pay more will pass.
It’s a shame that neither KC or STL support mass transit or cycling alternatives but continue to build-expand highways to support more sprawl. It’s also deplorable that Metro destroyed their credibility with the design, station placement, changed bus routes and extremely over budget construction costs in building the Extension. Metro has alienated many families that live along the line and have turned them from supporters to non-supporters due to poor management.
– –
Some suggest that the increased funding was to be used to serve the exurbs even further, particularly so the BPV fans could drink and not worry about driving. Even the Cardinal owners promoted prop M. The only factors which will change exurb attitudes are significantly higher fuel prices coupled with tolls on our highways and higher tax rates on mall parking lots.
– –
The New 64 proves that we continue to favor asphalt, noise, pollution, injuries and high energy consumption over our financial and physical health. Let’s hope that Metro gets its act together and improves service to the urban core. However, if the past is indicative of the future, I wouldn’t place any bets on it.
Jason, doesn’t it just make you wonder, if gas hadn’t dropped so much in the past few weeks, would Prop M have gotten enough “yes” votes to pass. Have to admit it was rather close. I like to think that most people are smart enough to realize there’s nothing to guarentee these lower prices will hang around forever, and more importantly that we should have some alternative to autos. Just because gas is cheap and a person can now say “Oh screw the bus, I can go back to driving to work” doesn’t mean it’s a good thing. Those who voted yes probably think that way. Unfortunately there are just too many self centered people that think if there’s nothing in it for them directly, then they’re against it. And to those people who say Metro officials are not accountable, well maybe that’s true, maybe not, but if you really feel that way, GET OFF YOUR BUTTS AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!
How would we go about getting something on the ballot in the next election to go ahead and start collecting the tax in the city that we approved a decade ago? Increased service in the city would go a long way toward helping the city. This could possibly be used to fund a North/South metrolink line within the city.
Jason, Thank you for saying I wasted my vote on Ralph Nader. There were actually 17,000 of us in Missouri. You know, the election was called before Missouri was even decided, so one could say you wasted your vote too.
I live in the city and could not vote for Prop M. It amazes me how quickly city folk resort to the white-flight name calling. Most of the people I spoke with about it agree that St. Louis needs better transit. However, they don’t trust Metro to manage funds properly. Frankly, I don’t blame them. Metro has much work to do before they can convince voters their money would be used for actual work.
So, who do they prefer to manage the funds? A metropolitan area that has trouble with a 1/2 cent sales tax increase to fund something relied upon by so many, and needed to remain in wide operation to be viable needs some counseling.
Karen,
.
Nader gets 17,000… MO was in the red by less than 6000 votes at last check. I guess I could have easily called out one of the other candidates who didn’t have a chance. Like I said in the previous election. A vote for Nader is a vote for Bush. I guess I still blame him for the 2000 election. I don’t have anything against the guy, and I respect his position and views, but when it comes down to the election, its going to take a lot more to break the 2 party system.
i voted for chuck baldwin. there were 8,181 of us in missouri. and there were 11,355 for bob barr. so there are more who chose those candidates closer to mccain than candidates closer to obama’s policies (barr+baldwin 19,536>18,727 nader+mckinney).
i disagree when people say that i was “throwing away my vote…you should have picked the lesser of two evils.” i completely disagree. voting for something you believe in is never a waste.
it lets the people you voted for know that you support their policies, their message, and that it’s worth fighting for…
you’re not selling out when you vote for what you believe in. it’s always important to continue fighting, even though all hope might seem lost…like anyone who’s ever been oppressed: irish, africans, jews, catholics, blah. or no matter how small the issue might seem to some who can’t fully understand the importance (the mcdonald’s on south grand).
anyway, it’s sort of irrelevant calling states “blue states or red states.” the vote was nearly the same for both candidates in missouri and some other states. you have to look at the policies of obama and mccain on a more full spectrum. it’s more like obama is navy blue and mccain is light blue. so missouri ended up being blue anyway.
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yea… but MISSOURI DIDNT PICK THE WINNER!
There goes our streak 🙁 The best I suppose 🙂
Thank you America.
As a city resident, I couldn’t vote for proposition M, but many thanks to the county folks who know the need for a surviving system of public transit with the hope of expansion. Long live well-funded and widely appreciated public transit, and let’s hope ‘M’ survives the night.
Missouri blew 6000 votes on independent candidates who didn’t stand a chance. Thank you Nader for keeping Missouri in the red (read with sarcasm of course). As for Proposition M, its too bad. I don’t have a good grasp on this one as I couldn’t vote for it, but my understanding is now Metro will have to cut services to areas west of 270 among other things. At least now they know who their core supporters are and we can get back on track to making Metrolink and Metro help those who care about it. It was not just about expanding metrolink. Are they now going to cut late night service for metrolink so those leaving the ball game will not be able to get back to the park and ride lots? Does this mean more cars coming downtown for the games? I heard some of the money was going to help expand the park and ride lots so people aren’t ticketed for parking along the service road because they can’t find space in the lot. I would be interested in seeing who supported this in the county and if they used these lots, or if those who used the lots turned down the proposition. Nevertheless- lets go south with Metrolink- maybe Jefferson County will want it instead.
Looks like Missouri has “won” the distinction of being the only “battleground” this year not going with the nation. But since this was the first time with a non-southerner leading the Dem ticket since the 1960s, I’d argue my native state never truly was really a bellwether, but more culturally, a North Arkansas. And with St. Louis and Kansas City defeating transit, when the most pro-transit White House taking office next year, even the “urban” voters of Missouri have decided not to move towards a different future.
This native St. Louisan now living in Charlotte for just over a year, I had joked with friends, if a state didn’t go blue this election, that’s somewhere I’d frankly think twice before moving there. Well, it looks like I’ve moved from somewhere held back by its majority to someplace where new voters can make a difference. Given the demographic track my former and new residences are on, this disparity will sadly only grow.
In summary, I always suspected I had moved to New South. Last night confirmed VA and NC really are the New South. But I never fully realized until last night I was already living in the Old South in St. Louis.
Considering the demographics of the state of Missouri and its most recent presidential election cycle voting history, I’d say the description of Bellwether has become inapt if not an outright anachronism. Bellwethers shift with prevailing waves of motion, and this simply hasn’t been that accurately applied to this state. One positive point of the state staying red in this historic election year is that we can all shut the hell up about “as goes ______________, so goes the nation”. A convincing mark of Change is the upheaval of seemingly intractable trends or traditions. Missouri got punked by a head fake, and the sign of the bellwether has likely been stolen by a New Mexico or a Nevada.
Jason: “It was not just about expanding metrolink.”
No, it definitely wasn’t. It wasn’t even just about Metrolink at all, but the [limited] public debate about the proposition focused only on potential expansion and service cuts to the light rail system. In the months and weeks leading up the election, I was surprised at how little attention was being paid to the potentially massive cuts to bus service throughout the area. Scores of people, living in both the county and the city, depend on MetroBus to get to work, not to mention taking their kids to school and doing necessary shopping. It frustrates me that beyond the attention given expanding MetroLink to Westport, virtually all the discussion on service cuts (which to me was a far more pressing component of the issue than expansion) focused merely on people from West County not being able to ride the train to baseball games. Do our local commentators simply not realize that not everyone can afford or chooses to buy a car?
This is not an issue of charity, either. Depriving unskilled workers a reasonable mode of transportation is a big blow to the local economy. I suspect outer county voters didn’t take into account when casting their ballots that it might suddenly become much more difficult to staff their fast food restaurants, cleaning crews, and security guard needs.
Also, to those who say “let those who use it pay for it,” I would say the same of basic road maintenance and the hugely expensive 64/40 overhaul. Let those who insist on driving in single-occupant vehicles all over the place pick up the tab for new road construction and maintenance by instituting tolls on all major roads. Holy mackerel, could you imagine the scale of the outcry if THAT issue were on the ballot?
Caveat: I am a voter in St. Louis County, not someone criticizing from the City or elsewhere. Needless to say, I am hugely disappointed (though not surprised) in the decision my electorate made last night against Prop M.
The defeat of proposition ‘M’ is punch to the gut. The suburbs are choking civilized communities, and apparently those living in sparsely populated areas and the suburbs will need to suffer a bit before they can fully appreciate the impact of some of their decisions. Sprawl pattern development drains a region’s ability to EFFICIENTLY provide the balance of services a healthy metropolitan area relies on. Limiting ourselves to one-dimensional mode of transit, and the most energy consumptive and land despoiling mode at that, is about as shrewd as paying for life’s typical expenses on a high interest rate credit card, letting the balance grow and grow past each billing cycle, and living from paycheck to paycheck just to survive-without any savings or investments for future need. Dumb.
Face it- when voting, the majority of the general public do little to educate themselves. They expect to be educated by the proponents or opponents of whatever we should have them vote on. Most of the time this is through ads on TV, flyers in the mail, robo-calls, billboards, signs, etc.. Even then they rarely pay attention until they get to the booth on election day. Then, quickly scanning the ballot they see the proposition short explanation… its going to cost the taxpayer “X” for “Y”. They evaluate …Will “Y” help me or my family?… No- okay, I check NO and move on. Yes? then I might check yes and move to the next one. This happened with every ballot initiative put before St. Louis city and from what I could tell, the majority of St. louis county and other outlying areas. Prop A- free so it passes. Prop B- also free and also passes. Prop C- pass. Prop M- costs STL county taxpayers so it fails, Classrooms for Kids in Festus? Hell no. Why should kids get the summer off anyway? The only people voting yes on that one actually had kids or were planning on having kids in the school district. As you can see- unless it affects the majority for the better there is no way any proposition asking the masses to pay more will pass.
It’s a shame that neither KC or STL support mass transit or cycling alternatives but continue to build-expand highways to support more sprawl. It’s also deplorable that Metro destroyed their credibility with the design, station placement, changed bus routes and extremely over budget construction costs in building the Extension. Metro has alienated many families that live along the line and have turned them from supporters to non-supporters due to poor management.
– –
Some suggest that the increased funding was to be used to serve the exurbs even further, particularly so the BPV fans could drink and not worry about driving. Even the Cardinal owners promoted prop M. The only factors which will change exurb attitudes are significantly higher fuel prices coupled with tolls on our highways and higher tax rates on mall parking lots.
– –
The New 64 proves that we continue to favor asphalt, noise, pollution, injuries and high energy consumption over our financial and physical health. Let’s hope that Metro gets its act together and improves service to the urban core. However, if the past is indicative of the future, I wouldn’t place any bets on it.
Jason, doesn’t it just make you wonder, if gas hadn’t dropped so much in the past few weeks, would Prop M have gotten enough “yes” votes to pass. Have to admit it was rather close. I like to think that most people are smart enough to realize there’s nothing to guarentee these lower prices will hang around forever, and more importantly that we should have some alternative to autos. Just because gas is cheap and a person can now say “Oh screw the bus, I can go back to driving to work” doesn’t mean it’s a good thing. Those who voted yes probably think that way. Unfortunately there are just too many self centered people that think if there’s nothing in it for them directly, then they’re against it. And to those people who say Metro officials are not accountable, well maybe that’s true, maybe not, but if you really feel that way, GET OFF YOUR BUTTS AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!
How would we go about getting something on the ballot in the next election to go ahead and start collecting the tax in the city that we approved a decade ago? Increased service in the city would go a long way toward helping the city. This could possibly be used to fund a North/South metrolink line within the city.
Jason, Thank you for saying I wasted my vote on Ralph Nader. There were actually 17,000 of us in Missouri. You know, the election was called before Missouri was even decided, so one could say you wasted your vote too.
I live in the city and could not vote for Prop M. It amazes me how quickly city folk resort to the white-flight name calling. Most of the people I spoke with about it agree that St. Louis needs better transit. However, they don’t trust Metro to manage funds properly. Frankly, I don’t blame them. Metro has much work to do before they can convince voters their money would be used for actual work.
So, who do they prefer to manage the funds? A metropolitan area that has trouble with a 1/2 cent sales tax increase to fund something relied upon by so many, and needed to remain in wide operation to be viable needs some counseling.
Karen,
.
Nader gets 17,000… MO was in the red by less than 6000 votes at last check. I guess I could have easily called out one of the other candidates who didn’t have a chance. Like I said in the previous election. A vote for Nader is a vote for Bush. I guess I still blame him for the 2000 election. I don’t have anything against the guy, and I respect his position and views, but when it comes down to the election, its going to take a lot more to break the 2 party system.
@Dennis
The voters did get off their butts and do something: they voted not to give them any more money!
jason,
i voted for chuck baldwin. there were 8,181 of us in missouri. and there were 11,355 for bob barr. so there are more who chose those candidates closer to mccain than candidates closer to obama’s policies (barr+baldwin 19,536>18,727 nader+mckinney).
i disagree when people say that i was “throwing away my vote…you should have picked the lesser of two evils.” i completely disagree. voting for something you believe in is never a waste.
it lets the people you voted for know that you support their policies, their message, and that it’s worth fighting for…
you’re not selling out when you vote for what you believe in. it’s always important to continue fighting, even though all hope might seem lost…like anyone who’s ever been oppressed: irish, africans, jews, catholics, blah. or no matter how small the issue might seem to some who can’t fully understand the importance (the mcdonald’s on south grand).
anyway, it’s sort of irrelevant calling states “blue states or red states.” the vote was nearly the same for both candidates in missouri and some other states. you have to look at the policies of obama and mccain on a more full spectrum. it’s more like obama is navy blue and mccain is light blue. so missouri ended up being blue anyway.