Hartford Now Two-Way…Briefly
The other day I was driving westbound on Hartford heading to Grand (map)Â and I noticed the street changed from being one-way westbound to two-way for a short distance east of Grand.
This probably changed months ago but I drive so rarely I hadn’t noticed. But why change such a short distance and not the entire street? Most likely the city didn’t want motorists to be able to avoid the light on Grand at Arsenal to go eastbound on Arsenal. You know, use the street grid as designed.  All over the city we’ve destroyed the grid, forcing drivers to use the main roads, not allowing  the use of the grid. Cars sit and idle at long traffic lights that all traffic must flow through. Hopefully someday we will allow the grid to be opened so traffic isn’t concentrated.
 – Steve Patterson
Actually it is to access the parking lot behind Commerce.
Actually it is to access the parking lot behind Commerce.
True, it was changed so motorists can access the horribly oversized parking lot behind Commerce. Our wonderful alderwoman and those part of South Grand (the business committee…..I’ve drawn a blank on the name) think this is what you call “progress”. Hopefully they see that this lot is RARELY used.
See the section on public parking http://www.southgrand.org/directions.html
See the section on public parking http://www.southgrand.org/directions.html
To get streets changed, it starts with residents. Â St. Louis is a complaint > response system.
To get streets changed, it starts with residents. St. Louis is a complaint > response system.
No rick it takes one old lady to call and BAM up goes the 4 way stop at every intersection. Three neighbors and Schoemehl pots appear breaking the grid. It is ridiculous.
To hell with traffic laws! Motorists should drive willy-nilly through narrow, residential streets. Wake up, St. Louis!
To hell with traffic laws! Motorists should drive willy-nilly through narrow, residential streets. Wake up, St. Louis!
True, it was changed so motorists can access the horribly oversized parking lot behind Commerce. Our wonderful alderwoman and those part of South Grand (the business committee…..I’ve drawn a blank on the name) think this is what you call “progress”. Hopefully they see that this lot is RARELY used.Â
First off this was changed approx. 9 months ago. A bit of old ‘news’ here. Secondly, it was converted when the public parking lot, which was long vacant and then was going to be condos but the economy took that project down, was finished and opened. The business community and MANY visitors to the Grand Corridor wanted more parking…hence the parking lot. And it’s free parking! For someone that wants people to get out and walk…they need a place to park their cars besides in the 2 or 3 spots in front of a select store.Â
And finally and most important….neighbors have say. This street ends at a dead end. Those on the dead end street want it to stay that way to stop exactly what you prescribe…cutting through neighborhoods to avoid lights. That is how kids and pedestrians get killed when we have a city full of stop-sign runners. And yes, there are a lot of kids in that area. Not to mention drug traffic and all the rest.
Some people just can’t be pleased.
First off this was changed approx. 9 months ago. A bit of old ‘news’ here. Secondly, it was converted when the public parking lot, which was long vacant and then was going to be condos but the economy took that project down, was finished and opened. The business community and MANY visitors to the Grand Corridor wanted more parking…hence the parking lot. And it’s free parking! For someone that wants people to get out and walk…they need a place to park their cars besides in the 2 or 3 spots in front of a select store.
And finally and most important….neighbors have say. This street ends at a dead end. Those on the dead end street want it to stay that way to stop exactly what you prescribe…cutting through neighborhoods to avoid lights. That is how kids and pedestrians get killed when we have a city full of stop-sign runners. And yes, there are a lot of kids in that area. Not to mention drug traffic and all the rest.
Some people just can’t be pleased.
I acknowledged I didn’t know when it happened, I rarely drive these days. The east end of that block is not a dead end, I pulled onto wb Hartford from Arkansas Ave. The next block east is a dead end. The street is very wide and with houses only on one side cars the one way traffic tends to go fast as drivers rush to get to Grand.
Rush rush rush……just wish people would stop when stop means stop. If memory serves, it was a 2 way but I think when they put the lot in behind Bread Co is when they made it one way…..too many people trying to cut through the Grand/Arsen intersection…again violating the law
When did taking different routes to avoid a stop light become against the law, assuming all traffic laws are followed correctly?
Moe–
The problem with closed streets is one of fairness, to me.
Great, so you and your neighbors organized to close a street to through-traffic to make it safer for pedestrians and root out drugs. What about my block, just one over, where now all the speeders and drug traffickers head? What if I can’t organize a group to close my street off?
Street closures aren’t fair because they simply shift problems.
Plus, the pressure applied to un-closed streets, especially major ones, usually lends itself to autocentric planning. More cars use main roads (some of the only through-ways through many of our neighborhoods) and that means more services for cars: auto body and tire shops; gas stations; car washes, etc. In other words, constricting our grid system to resemble the hierarchy of suburban roads (major thoroughfare; series of private cul-de-sacs shooting off) gets us just that: a suburban character.
I think a road should only be allowed to be closed if its property owners agree to a tax increase and the street becomes essentially private.
I acknowledged I didn’t know when it happened, I rarely drive these days. The east end of that block is not a dead end, I pulled onto wb Hartford from Arkansas Ave. The next block east is a dead end. The street is very wide and with houses only on one side cars the one way traffic tends to go fast as drivers rush to get to Grand.
Rush rush rush……just wish people would stop when stop means stop. If memory serves, it was a 2 way but I think when they put the lot in behind Bread Co is when they made it one way…..too many people trying to cut through the Grand/Arsen intersection…again violating the law
Regardless, the parking lot does indeed sit empty all of the time, with just one or two cars on average. I have watched it carefully to see how much people are using it.
Regardless, the parking lot does indeed sit empty all of the time, with just one or two cars on average. I have watched it carefully to see how much people are using it.
Give it time. The lot was just finished this past fall. I’m sure 1) many don’t know there is a lot there 2) some feel this is way off the beaten path so it is 3) unsafe. Once the warm weather arrives, I’m sure the usage will pick up as people are willing to walk more.
Give it time. The lot was just finished this past fall. I’m sure 1) many don’t know there is a lot there 2) some feel this is way off the beaten path so it is 3) unsafe. Once the warm weather arrives, I’m sure the usage will pick up as people are willing to walk more.
When did taking different routes to avoid a stop light become against the law, assuming all traffic laws are followed correctly?
I think it had more to do with increasing access to the new public parking lot behind the bank. The South Grand CID is SO EXCITED about that freaking parking lot.
I think it had more to do with increasing access to the new public parking lot behind the bank. The South Grand CID is SO EXCITED about that freaking parking lot.
I don’t love it either but signed clearly I don’t think it’s a huge issue. More important, safety-wise, one block away on Grand approaching Arsenal from the North there is a dedicated turn lane that’s a disaster. It’s marked so near the intersection that drivers panic to get over at the last minute to continue South on Grand. And three blocks or so from there, on Spring in Tower Grove “Heights” there are the odd, unpredictable intersections without a stop signs. Not that I Iove all of the stop signs but it seems to me consistency in important.
I don’t love it either but signed clearly I don’t think it’s a huge issue. More important, safety-wise, one block away on Grand approaching Arsenal from the North there is a dedicated turn lane that’s a disaster. It’s marked so near the intersection that drivers panic to get over at the last minute to continue South on Grand. And three blocks or so from there, on Spring in Tower Grove “Heights” there are the odd, unpredictable intersections without a stop signs. Not that I Iove all of the stop signs but it seems to me consistency in important.
Moe–
The problem with closed streets is one of fairness, to me.
Great, so you and your neighbors organized to close a street to through-traffic to make it safer for pedestrians and root out drugs. What about my block, just one over, where now all the speeders and drug traffickers head? What if I can’t organize a group to close my street off?
Street closures aren’t fair because they simply shift problems.
Plus, the pressure applied to un-closed streets, especially major ones, usually lends itself to autocentric planning. More cars use main roads (some of the only through-ways through many of our neighborhoods) and that means more services for cars: auto body and tire shops; gas stations; car washes, etc. In other words, constricting our grid system to resemble the hierarchy of suburban roads (major thoroughfare; series of private cul-de-sacs shooting off) gets us just that: a suburban character.
I think a road should only be allowed to be closed if its property owners agree to a tax increase and the street becomes essentially private.
OH MY GODDESS! Stop, stop STOP IT ALREADY breaking the freaking grid! It is insane! As Steve mentions here, the whole point of the grid is to allow traffic dispersal, and that avoids speeding and dangers. We are NOT ELLISVILLE! Every street should not force one to an artery to a thoroughfare. That is SUBURBAN planning and it SUCKS. Also, there would not be so many stop sign rollers if there was not a stop sign at EVERY FREAKING intersection. Quit trying to make one way in and one way out parking lots, as a matter of fact stop building curbside parking lots. We are a CITY. Quit forbidding left hand turns and rights on red. If you didn’t narrow blvds to one lane, there would be two lanes to keep traffic moving while people wait to turn. If you have to create dedicated turn lanes in the heart of the city, then you belong in the COUNTY. Take yourself there, please! Go indulge your fttish on Manchester or in freaking Gravois Bluffs!
And what is the deal with 6 minute long red lights. There are not enough cars in the midwest to occupy that time in cross traffic. So why do I spend half my life sitting at red lights looking right and left and not a car, not a SOUL to be seen for blocks? What happened to this “CITY” while I was gone for a decade. My goodness!
I ended up stuck in this one way last weekend. I saw a spot opposite Mangia Italiano and wanted to circle back. Well the bank lot has been there forever, so I won’t blame them. But why did I hit a one way half way? So I try to go South to get back to grand and it was a blocked parking lot. SO I had to turn around (wait for the light) turn left and then U-ie it because there is no guarantee of any contiguous 4 streets that form a block that one can circle in a car ANYWHERE in the freaking city and I was NOT waiting at another light. It was seriously 12-15 minutes to get back to a spot 1/2 block away! WTF!
Someone is acting out their anal fixation on all the drivers of this city and you are KILLING IT! If it is THAT hard for me to get to a place on GRAND on a Saturday night? Others would not venture into the ‘hood, much less getting “stuck” in a one way half street at night! lmao Thank you for listening. @francis slay are you listening?